Comments on: Moodle vs Sakai: FIGHT! http://www.darcynorman.net/2006/02/06/moodle-vs-sakai-fight/ just a lowly edtech geek, mumble mumble university of calgary Fri, 19 Mar 2010 20:41:04 -0600 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Alastair Robertson http://www.darcynorman.net/2006/02/06/moodle-vs-sakai-fight/#comment-194096 Alastair Robertson Sun, 07 Dec 2008 17:49:20 +0000 1507420180#comment-194096 How fascinating to see a 2 year old debate such as this! At Lancaster we have exploited both Moodle and Sakai technologies. Sakai, although moderately more complex to install, seems to win in terms of user perspectives. We run leadership training courses for business professionals, in year 1 we used Moodle to provide course management and discussions and it was little used. Year 2, this year, we have used Sakai and the feedback is much more positive. During the first 6 weeks of the course participants logged in 340 times (25 participants are enrolled on the course)and made 250 forum entries. Additionally to this success we now provide e-collaboration and e-community services to researchers using Sakai. Again, the feedback is very positive from users in terms of Sakai's flexibility and range of service. How fascinating to see a 2 year old debate such as this! At Lancaster we have exploited both Moodle and Sakai technologies. Sakai, although moderately more complex to install, seems to win in terms of user perspectives. We run leadership training courses for business professionals, in year 1 we used Moodle to provide course management and discussions and it was little used. Year 2, this year, we have used Sakai and the feedback is much more positive. During the first 6 weeks of the course participants logged in 340 times (25 participants are enrolled on the course)and made 250 forum entries. Additionally to this success we now provide e-collaboration and e-community services to researchers using Sakai. Again, the feedback is very positive from users in terms of Sakai’s flexibility and range of service.

]]> By: elearning http://www.darcynorman.net/2006/02/06/moodle-vs-sakai-fight/#comment-194076 elearning Thu, 20 Nov 2008 23:36:04 +0000 1507420180#comment-194076 It's easy to install Moodle but it's difficult to install Sakai. Also, there are alot of documentatios and materials about Moodle but there are less about Sakai. It’s easy to install Moodle but it’s difficult to install Sakai.

Also, there are alot of documentatios and materials about Moodle but there are less about Sakai.

]]> By: BlackBoard & WebCT http://www.darcynorman.net/2006/02/06/moodle-vs-sakai-fight/#comment-81194 BlackBoard & WebCT Wed, 31 Dec 1969 17:00:00 +0000 1507420180#comment-81194 <strong>Moodle vs Sakai FIGHT!</strong> Zack Rosen just posted a comparison of Moodle and Sakai, based on some available online web- and project metrics (not an evaluation of the software itself). The comparison reads like something written by a Moodle supporter, intending to show how... Moodle vs Sakai FIGHT!

Zack Rosen just posted a comparison of Moodle and Sakai, based on some available online web- and project metrics (not an evaluation of the software itself). The comparison reads like something written by a Moodle supporter, intending to show how…

]]> By: Heather Ross http://www.darcynorman.net/2006/02/06/moodle-vs-sakai-fight/#comment-81195 Heather Ross Wed, 31 Dec 1969 17:00:00 +0000 1507420180#comment-81195 D'Arcy, Interesting stuff on Moodle and Sakai. I'm curious if you might have some recommendations on resources for less than expert geeks on using Moodle. I have been working exclusively with WebCT because that's what the organizations I do work for are currently using. D’Arcy,

Interesting stuff on Moodle and Sakai. I’m curious if you might have some recommendations on resources for less than expert geeks on using Moodle. I have been working exclusively with WebCT because that’s what the organizations I do work for are currently using.

]]> By: D'Arcy http://www.darcynorman.net/2006/02/06/moodle-vs-sakai-fight/#comment-81196 D'Arcy Wed, 31 Dec 1969 17:00:00 +0000 1507420180#comment-81196 Heather - all I know of is the documentation on the moodle.org website. There is likely something better to act as an intro or guide, but it's probably the best starting point... Best thing I'd recommend - download a copy of Moodle to your desktop and play with it. It should run anywhere that has a webserver, PHP and MySQL - and those are all downloadable if your desktop doesn't have them. Heather – all I know of is the documentation on the moodle.org website. There is likely something better to act as an intro or guide, but it’s probably the best starting point… Best thing I’d recommend – download a copy of Moodle to your desktop and play with it. It should run anywhere that has a webserver, PHP and MySQL – and those are all downloadable if your desktop doesn’t have them.

]]> By: Zack Rosen http://www.darcynorman.net/2006/02/06/moodle-vs-sakai-fight/#comment-81197 Zack Rosen Wed, 31 Dec 1969 17:00:00 +0000 1507420180#comment-81197 Hey D'Arcy. A few points * I've gotten some well deserved flack over the tone of my messages about Sakai and Moodle. But in the grand scheme of things I think the higher ed ICT community has been far to congenial for it's own good and the numbers presented speak for themselves. Putting that much weight (funding / partnerships) behind Sakai in light of the Moodle project's success was a phenominally stupid waste of resources and will result in a lot of people being burned. While the purpose of Sakai was to advance the cause of open-source software in higher-ed I think it will end up hurting that effort by sucking up headspace and funding from the Moodle project. * I am not involved in either Moodle or Sakai, I am a third party observer with a strong interest in open-source projects for the public sector. * According to this internal survey: http://moodle.org/mod/choice/view.php?id=158 Moodle deployments in higher ed are their largest user base. * According to the project lead of Moodle the 8,900 number reflects those that have chosen to advertise their Moodle install back with the community. Many running Moodle sites do not do this so it is believed it is actually an under representative number: http://www.zacker.org/sakai-project-vs-moodle#comment-61 Hey D’Arcy. A few points

* I’ve gotten some well deserved flack over the tone of my messages about Sakai and Moodle. But in the grand scheme of things I think the higher ed ICT community has been far to congenial for it’s own good and the numbers presented speak for themselves. Putting that much weight (funding / partnerships) behind Sakai in light of the Moodle project’s success was a phenominally stupid waste of resources and will result in a lot of people being burned. While the purpose of Sakai was to advance the cause of open-source software in higher-ed I think it will end up hurting that effort by sucking up headspace and funding from the Moodle project.
* I am not involved in either Moodle or Sakai, I am a third party observer with a strong interest in open-source projects for the public sector.
* According to this internal survey:
http://moodle.org/mod/choice/view.php?id=158
Moodle deployments in higher ed are their largest user base.
* According to the project lead of Moodle the 8,900 number reflects those that have chosen to advertise their Moodle install back with the community. Many running Moodle sites do not do this so it is believed it is actually an under representative number:
http://www.zacker.org/sakai-project-vs-moodle#comment-61

]]> By: Scott Leslie http://www.darcynorman.net/2006/02/06/moodle-vs-sakai-fight/#comment-81198 Scott Leslie Wed, 31 Dec 1969 17:00:00 +0000 1507420180#comment-81198 You should check out the comment on Zack's post that was just left under the title "Have you taked to USERS of Sakai?" - ouch! This is something no one really wants to talk about, usability of any of these systems (let alone the related issue of 'and how does it actually support learning'), because it is hard to measure. But here's my experience; install Moodle, put an instructor or a student in front of it, wait 5 minutes, come back, voila, already they are up and going. Sakai...maybe not so much. Not that I am in particular volunteering, but this is an area in need of much improvement, how to compare the usability and effectiveness of these CMS (and other non-CMS approaches). You should check out the comment on Zack’s post that was just left under the title “Have you taked to USERS of Sakai?” – ouch! This is something no one really wants to talk about, usability of any of these systems (let alone the related issue of ‘and how does it actually support learning’), because it is hard to measure. But here’s my experience; install Moodle, put an instructor or a student in front of it, wait 5 minutes, come back, voila, already they are up and going. Sakai…maybe not so much. Not that I am in particular volunteering, but this is an area in need of much improvement, how to compare the usability and effectiveness of these CMS (and other non-CMS approaches).

]]> By: D'Arcy http://www.darcynorman.net/2006/02/06/moodle-vs-sakai-fight/#comment-81199 D'Arcy Wed, 31 Dec 1969 17:00:00 +0000 1507420180#comment-81199 Agreed. I'm using Moodle on a project, not Sakai. Usability-wise, Moodle is better than the Big Name LMS we use on campus. Deployment-wise, it's way easier to set up than a Big Java App. Best of both worlds. I'd love to see some objective analysis (and metrics if possible) on the usability of all systems from multiple perspectives (student, instructor, administrator, server geek) One of the things I love about Moodle is the flexible content. Want to have activities as part of the online course? OK. Self-grading assignments? Sure. Wiki-as-lesson? Uh huh. etc.... It's either built-in or easily added via modules/plugins. The other Big LMSs have their own plugins/modules/building blocks, but they feel duct-taped together... Agreed. I’m using Moodle on a project, not Sakai. Usability-wise, Moodle is better than the Big Name LMS we use on campus. Deployment-wise, it’s way easier to set up than a Big Java App. Best of both worlds.

I’d love to see some objective analysis (and metrics if possible) on the usability of all systems from multiple perspectives (student, instructor, administrator, server geek)

One of the things I love about Moodle is the flexible content. Want to have activities as part of the online course? OK. Self-grading assignments? Sure. Wiki-as-lesson? Uh huh. etc…. It’s either built-in or easily added via modules/plugins. The other Big LMSs have their own plugins/modules/building blocks, but they feel duct-taped together…

]]> By: Jeff http://www.darcynorman.net/2006/02/06/moodle-vs-sakai-fight/#comment-81200 Jeff Wed, 31 Dec 1969 17:00:00 +0000 1507420180#comment-81200 Building on D'Arcy's comments about additional metrics, it would be great to see a performance/stress test for Moodle vs Sakai. The long running critique of Moodle is their bloated code and the long running critique of J2EE projects like Sakai is the inherent bloat of Java. I'd be interested to see the results of bloat vs bloat ;) Building on D’Arcy’s comments about additional metrics, it would be great to see a performance/stress test for Moodle vs Sakai. The long running critique of Moodle is their bloated code and the long running critique of J2EE projects like Sakai is the inherent bloat of Java. I’d be interested to see the results of bloat vs bloat ;)

]]> By: Zack Rosen http://www.darcynorman.net/2006/02/06/moodle-vs-sakai-fight/#comment-81201 Zack Rosen Wed, 31 Dec 1969 17:00:00 +0000 1507420180#comment-81201 Jeff: Moodle has deployments serving 180K learners (in NZ). Sakai's biggest known live deployment is UMich w/ 50K learners. UMich spends 5.75 FTE's a year in support costs alone on Sakai and I've been quoted $60K a year costs for full support for an outside consultant for Moodle of 50K learners so it seems Sakai's TCO is far larger than Moodle's. Jeff: Moodle has deployments serving 180K learners (in NZ). Sakai’s biggest known live deployment is UMich w/ 50K learners. UMich spends 5.75 FTE’s a year in support costs alone on Sakai and I’ve been quoted $60K a year costs for full support for an outside consultant for Moodle of 50K learners so it seems Sakai’s TCO is far larger than Moodle’s.

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